Bethea's Byte
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short I6KIB
Welcome to Bethea's Byte. If you are a member, please sign in and participate. If you are not a member, please sign up and join the conversation. We'd love to hear from you.
WELCOME TO BETHEA'S BYTE
To all guests of this site, please feel free to look things over, but you are encouraged to register and take part in discussing all news reports posted here. You are also encouraged, as a member to post your own news stories. You are also encouraged to debate these stories as well, especially in the political areas. All I ask is that no matter what side you're on, keep the debates civil. If you are joining us from another forum, affiliate with us. We are more than happy to check you out, join your site and participate with you as well. The Arcade is not set to keep score, but it is set for fun. So play the games and test your skills and your luck. Again, you are welcome here at Bethea's Byte. BYTE THIS!
Latest topics
» hello everyone
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Yesterday at 4:18 pm by Kyng

» Disney Drops 'Fox' Name and Will Rebrand Its Movie Studio as '20th Century'
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Yesterday at 4:13 pm by The Last Outlaw

» How are you feeling right now?
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Yesterday at 4:11 pm by Kyng

» ‘Once This Is Over, We’ll Be Kings’: How Lev Parnas Worked His Way Into Trump’s World — And Now Is Rattling It
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Sat Jan 18, 2020 6:19 pm by The Last Outlaw

» Dwayne ‘The Rock’ Johnson Breaks His Silence on His Father’s Death at 75: ‘I’m in Pain’
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Fri Jan 17, 2020 3:19 pm by The Last Outlaw

» Ex-White House Ethics Chief Calls McConnell A 'Perjurer' After Senator Takes Impeachment Oath: He Said 'The Exact Opposite'
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Fri Jan 17, 2020 2:57 pm by The Last Outlaw

» Senate Opens Impeachment Trial Against President Trump: Chief Justice John Roberts Sworn In
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Thu Jan 16, 2020 3:24 pm by The Last Outlaw

» Impeachment Managers Deliver Charges to Senate, Paving the Way for Trial
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 6:08 pm by The Last Outlaw

» Impeachment Manager Val Demings Has Called For McConnell's Recusal From Senate Trial
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:50 pm by The Last Outlaw

» What was the last movie you saw?
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 4:27 pm by Kyng

» What are you looking forward to right now?
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 4:26 pm by Kyng

» Putin Moves to Shore Up Power as Medvedev Resigns
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 4:25 pm by Kyng

» The All-Brown Royal Family Outfits: Are They Sending Us A Message?
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 4:23 pm by The Last Outlaw

» Rocky Johnson Dead: The Rock's Wrestler Dad Passes Away at Age 75
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 3:53 pm by The Last Outlaw

» 'Jeopardy!: The Greatest of All Time' Crowns Ken Jennings Winner
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 2:16 pm by The Last Outlaw

» Rock & Roll Hall of Fame Reveals Class of 2020
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 1:59 pm by The Last Outlaw

» Meghan Markle Steps Out For The First Time Since Stepping Back as a Senior Royal
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:41 am by The Last Outlaw

» House Votes to Send Trump Impeachment to Senate For Trial
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 11:26 am by The Last Outlaw

» McConnell, Schumer Issue Ground Rules For Impeachment Trial
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:58 am by The Last Outlaw

» Pelosi Announces House Impeachment Managers to Prosecute Case Against Trump
How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Clock-10Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:44 am by The Last Outlaw

Top posting users this week

Top posting users this month
Log in

I forgot my password

Who is online?
In total there are 2 users online :: 1 Registered, 0 Hidden and 1 Guest

The Last Outlaw

[ View the whole list ]


Most users ever online was 156 on Wed Jul 03, 2019 11:22 am
Statistics
We have 28 registered users
The newest registered user is justjane

Our users have posted a total of 2334 messages in 1004 subjects
January 2020
SunMonTueWedThuFriSat
   1234
567891011
12131415161718
19202122232425
262728293031 

Calendar Calendar

Notifications
    Affiliate With Bethea’s Byte


    Bethea's Byte

    Anti-Spam Bots!

    Submit Your Site To The Web's Top 50 Search Engines for Free!






    The Coffee House


    Planet Nexus


    IconSkouliki



    How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short

    View previous topic View next topic Go down

    The Last Outlaw
    The Last Outlaw
    Head Administrator
    Head Administrator
    Male Posts : 1271
    Age : 43
    Join date : 2018-05-25
    Location : Salem, Oregon, USA
    Status :
    How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short BgLx6
    How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short BgMuy

    https://betheasbyte.forumotion.com/forum

    PostThe Last Outlaw on Thu Dec 05, 2019 4:39 pm

    How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short IlWna

    From The Washington Post

    Amber Philips of The Washington Post wrote:The linchpin of Democrats’ impeachment evidence against President Trump didn’t come from the 17 witnesses they called, or from hours of public hearings and subpoenaed documents and phone records. It came from Trump’s own mouth. Specifically, his July 25 call with Ukraine’s newly elected president, where Trump asked him to investigate Democrats.

    At the time of the call, multiple witnesses were perplexed why Trump was holding up military aid to Ukraine. Others couldn’t understand why Trump was reluctant to meet with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky in the Oval Office. They testified that when they heard the call or read its transcript months later it all clicked for them. Trump was holding these things back to get Ukraine to investigate his political opponents.

    Democrats have taken that a step further: The call itself is evidence Trump was leveraging the power of his office and official diplomatic tools to help his reelection.

    So how are Republicans defending Trump’s call now that it’s a central piece of evidence against him? And where does their defense fall short? Let’s review some of the main things they said in Wednesday’s House Judiciary Committee hearing.

    Defense No. 1: Trump asked Zelensky for a favor for the country, not for him

    This defense centers on Trump’s first ask to Zelensky in the call, which comes right after Zelensky mentions getting more weapons from the United States. “I would like you to do us a favor, though, because our country has been through a lot, and Ukraine knows about it,” Trump replied.

    A couple of Republican lawmakers said that Trump was talking about how the Mueller investigation had put the country through “a lot,” and therefore he wanted Ukraine to help. (The call took place the day after special counsel Robert S. Mueller III testified to Congress about his findings in the Russia investigation.)

    Rep. Andy Biggs (R-Ariz.): “Here, there president’s talking about the country. That’s what he’s talking about.”

    Where this falls short: Even if you agree with the unsubstantiated premise that the Mueller report was driven by politics rather than facts, it makes no sense why Trump would want a foreign country to help him out here. What was Ukraine going to do to try to heal partisan divisions in America wrought by Russian meddling and the ensuing investigation?

    More likely is that Trump was trying to place his request to investigate Democrats in the context of the Mueller investigation, which he saw as unfair to him. We know the Ukraine allegations were derived from trying to undermine Mueller.

    Defense No. 2 and 3: Zelensky said the call was okay, and he eventually got his military aid

    How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short $

    Rep. F. James Sensenbrenner Jr. (R-Wis.) made these dual defenses in one sentence: “Zelensky has said there was no pressure on me, and the aid came through within six weeks after the phone call in question was made.”

    Where that falls short: It ignores timing and context. Zelensky has a strong motivation to say he didn’t feel pressured on the call with Trump. There’s evidence the Ukrainians may have at least suspected their military aid was held up when Trump talked to their president. And Zelensky still hasn’t received an Oval Office meeting with Trump, which would go a long way to helping him fight Russian-backed separatists. His country is at war. Zelensky can’t afford to upset Trump by accusing him of wrongdoing.

    As for the second point, it’s true Trump released the aid. But Trump did it only after a whistleblower complaint was circulating. The New York Times reports that Trump was told about the complaint against him before the aid got released.

    Defense No. 4: Trump doesn’t say “investigate Democrats to get your money” on the call

    Here’s Rep. John Ratcliffe (R-Tex.): “So if military aid, or security assistance is part of that quid pro quo, where in the July 25 transcript does President Trump ever suggest that he intends to withhold military aid for any reason?”

    Where that falls short: Trump didn’t have to be that explicit for Ukraine to know what was going on. Even if Ukrainians didn’t know for sure that Trump had held up their military aid, they knew an Oval Office meeting hung in the balance of what was said on this phone call. Trump also asks for some of the investigations as Zelensky brings up military aid.

    National security experts have testified that when the president of the United States asks “for a favor, though” from a smaller country reliant on the United States to help fight its battles, it’s not a “favor.” It’s a demand.

    “In this case, the power disparity between the two leaders, my impression is that in order to get the White House meeting, President Zelensky would have to deliver the investigations,” testified Lt. Col. Alexander Vindman, the White House’s top Ukraine expert who listened in on the call.

    Defense No. 5: In subsequent meetings with Zelensky, no one demanded a quid pro quo

    Here’s Rep. Jim Jordan (R-Ohio): “But you know what did happen in those 55 days that the aid was paused? There were five key meetings between President Zelensky and senior officials in our government. … None of those five meetings was aid ever discussed in exchange for an announcement of an investigation into anybody, not one of them.”

    Where this falls short: It’s just not true, especially when you zoom out to conversations Trump officials say they had with Zelensky’s aides.

    • European Union Ambassador Gordon Sondland testified Zelensky asked about aid when meeting with Vice President Pence in September.
    • After that meeting, Sondland told a Zelensky aide that they needed to announce political investigations to get their military aid.
    • Other testimony suggests that diplomats in Trump’s orbit told Zelensky in early July there was a quid pro quo to get his White House meeting.
    • At one of those meetings Jordan outlines, a September meeting between two U.S. senators and Zelensky, Zelensky asks about the aid again, The New York Times reports. He was told only Trump could release it.

    In fact, there was so much communication between Washington and Ukraine about all of this that Zelensky had an interview set up with CNN to announce these political investigations — which witnesses testified he didn’t want to do — and it only got scuttled when the whistleblower complaint came out.

    Welp, Trump's fat goes deeper into the fire. Keep this in mind, this is unfair to Trump, but this same proceedure was fair to the last President who was impeached (but was not removed from office), Bill Clinton.

    Here's what's gonna happen. Donald Trump will be impeached, but he will not be removed from office. Here's the obvious reason: A Democratic house will impeach, but a Republican Senate will vote not to remove Trump. That keeps the Republican party in lockstep with Trump on anything. Remember, anything Republican is fair to Trump. anything Democrat is not.

    Everything you just read starting with "Here's what's gonna happen...", that was not a prediction. It was a spoiler.

    Just Saying.
    How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short I6goy

    _________________
    How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short BvZDcHow Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short IEoIn
    How Republicans’ Latest Defenses of the Trump-Zelensky Call Fall Short Nexads420

    View previous topic View next topic Back to top

    Create an account or log in to leave a reply

    You need to be a member in order to leave a reply.

    Create an account

    Join our community by creating a new account. It's easy!


    Create a new account

    Log in

    Already have an account? No problem, log in here.


    Log in

     
    Permissions in this forum:
    You cannot reply to topics in this forum